ODPs - Can ATC assign them?

OttoFeather Newcomer

Can an ODP be directed by ATC? The AIM seems to suggest otherwise. The reason I'm asking this is a fellow pilot was read the riot act for not flying an ODP that ATC directed.


AIM 5-2-8. Instrument Departure Procedures (DP) - Obstacle Departure Procedures (ODP) and Standard Instrument Departures (SID)

(exerpted)

ODPs are recommended for obstruction clearance and may be flown without ATC clearance unless an alternate departure procedure (SID or radar vector) has been specifically assigned by ATC.

What's the verdict? Remember pilots don't carry around y'all manual.

Roddy_Piper Resident Knucklehead Vegas baby

we used to issue the ODP. if it is assigned, and pilot agrees, then it's to be flown. i read the paragraph u quoted as reading that the pilot could fly the ODP even if it isn't issued by ATC. it's the pilot prerogative to fly it in the absence of a DP, but HAS to be flown if assigned.

at south lake tahoe (TVL) we had a SID that came off of runway 36, however there were times that runway 36 was not an option for the pilot (usually wind). so, the only thing we could issue was the runway 18 ODP. there was just no other way to do it if the pilot couldn't get out of the 13,000 foot MVAs without climbing through a cloud. we couldn't exactly clear a pilot "as filed" because we had to tie them down somehow being in such close proximity to reno (RNO).

DairyCreamer Senior Member Elsewhere

Absolutely ATC may assign an ODP.

From the .65 4-3-2 Departure Clearances:

We have to do it occasionally out of Sierra Blanca when the Air Force is playing with more than just their airspace west of the airport.

If a pilot almost prangs in to an aircraft/mountain or violates airspace because he didn't follow a specifically assigned procedure, you're damn right that pilot should be read the riot act. Ok, not rudely, but we gave an instruction to preserve his own life, and he just kinda said "meh... I want to die today, I'm gonna do my own thing."

The paragraph you quoted from the AIM in no way says that ATC can't assign an ODP... it only states that a pilot may choose to fly one on their own without ATC clearance unless ATC has explicitly assigned a different SID or radar vector.

An example of that... I'd say 90+% of clearances I give from my center sectors are "cleared to XYZ airport as filed..." If I say that and nothing else to indicate a specific route assignment, the pilot may choose to fly an ODP of their own volition without notifying ATC (though it would be kind of them to notify us, but not required).

If I say "cleared to XYZ airport, ABCDE1 departure (or radar vectors to ABC), bla bla," then a pilot may not fly an ODP unless they get explicit ATC approval to do so.

If ATC says "N12345, cleared to XYZ airport, depart via BCD airport RWY 18 departure procedure, bla bla bla," I'd say there's a 99.9% chance there's a life/license-saving reason why we're issuing it.

~Nate

OttoFeather Newcomer

Good to know info!! Thanks for the references also.

Had an occasion recently where we weren't able to make the obstacle climb gradient on a SID. The ODP allowed it but ATC was unable clear us on it. Seems that the numerous towers that are NOTAMed were the issue. Sounds like it a good idea to inform tower of your ODP intentions beforehand (yes, I realize the ODP is only an option if given no vectors or a SID).

Once again, good info.