What would you change about phraseology?

jarhead0863 Trusted Member Grand Forks, ND

It's not like most of the IAF's are easy to say either.

SnowAviation Senior Member Escondido, CA

I don't care how hard it is for people who don't understand english to
navigate the system, they choose to fly in an english speaking world...

...so learn it.

I would INSIST that all GPS fixes be easily pronounceable.

atcpookie Junior Member FAA Headquarters, Washington, DC

Why? You don't have to say them...

Roddy_Piper Resident Knucklehead Vegas baby

you don't??

how do u clear someone for a RNAV (GPS) approach? how do u clear someone to shortcut an RNAV arrival or departure? how do u clear someone down the line in the enroute environment? u don't just use navaid fixes do u?

heck, even in the tower i've used RNAV fixes. u must be at a small level 5 vfr tower if u don't ever use RNAV fixes.

atcpookie Junior Member FAA Headquarters, Washington, DC

You might want to try reading my response again..... and then try reading the .65.

I never said you don't have to use them. and your lame attempt at trying to put me down just proves where you are.

I said you don't have to say them.

to answer your questions... you can say things like "center/north/south initial approach fix" the .65 even allows you to spell it out if you want.


Try and be a little more mature next time. don't be like the failures on here that just prove there level by trying to insult instead of having a basic conversation.

Roddy_Piper Resident Knucklehead Vegas baby

RNAV fixes are routinely spoken. i've never heard center/north/south initial approach fix spoken. not saying your wrong and you can't say it that way, but your going to have to show me that paragraph. never knew or heard of it being done that way.

there are still tons of other ways RNAV fixes enter our world. PDC/PDAC/shortcuts, RNAV arrivals/RNAV departures/etc.

i'm not sure i agree that i'm trying to "put you down". it's a legitimate question. if i was belittling you then i sincerely apologize.

me saying your at a level 5 vfr tower is me asking where you work that u don't use them. it has to be the only possible place that could avoid RNAV fixes on a routine basis. i know i've used it in the tower, use it 10 times an hour in the tracon, and used it constantly in the center.

atcpookie Junior Member FAA Headquarters, Washington, DC

RNAV(GPS) fixes ARE routinely spoken, because it’s the easiest way, Routine dose not mean that it’s the only way to do it. I have found that many people start thinking that just because that’s the way they’ve “always” done it, means that’s how it’s done and they’ve never heard of another way. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a good thing to find something that works for oneself, but mot get stuck in a rut and forget that there are other ways.

If you are really apologizing, then I accept. However, if you were asking a real question then you would have asked it, and NOT put it down in a belittling manner.

Also, EVERY facility uses RNAV(GPS) fixes now, unless, you can find a facility that doesn’t issue clearances.

As far as wanting to know my history; level 7 TOWER/TRACON, Level 11 TRACON, Center, Level 11 TRACON SUP, DC.

As far as pointing it out for you, I’m not going to read the .65 for you. I got tired of doing that on here for all the children. I can tell you that throughout chapters 3 & 5 there are several examples of using CENTER/NORTH/SOUTH/EAST/WEST and even saying the name of the IAF & FAF. It even lets you say things like “8 miles from the VOR” instead of using the FAF. Even the TREPS rules mentions things like that. Not to mention that in the beginning of the .65 it tells you that you are allowed to spell things out for clarification.

Roddy_Piper Resident Knucklehead Vegas baby

fair enough. i just know it's a pain in the arse to spell things out instead of just "pronouncing" them. if it works for u that way then more power to u.

my my, now who's being immature and belittling. i expect that from us little peon worker bees, not from a sup.

your right though...it does get old quoting the .65 on this site. especially the ATC101 type stuff. simply put, it's not "the way they?ve ?always? done it" mentality in the case of RNAV fixes. it's the easiest and most logical way. spelling out fixes get old really quick. u try saying YOSEM or yankee oscar sierra echo mike and tell me which one is better.

atcpookie Junior Member FAA Headquarters, Washington, DC

That is where I stand.....

Centerpuke Junior Member ZTL

You shouldn't do that with any aircraft.