Changes to AT-CTI Program

Jan 5, 2010
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www.jetphotos.net
I saw this article on avweb.com. What this panel suggests is that every single CTI application be graded out of 100 based on certain criteria as indicated by a pie chart. 40% would account for your level of CTI school. 10% would go to your GPA. 15% would go to your AT-SAT score. 15% would be based on an interview. And finally up to 20% by a “panel assessment”. It also recommends that Level 1 CTI schools be separated into its own hiring pool from Level 2, 3, and 4 CTI schools. As a current Vaughn AT-CTI student, I'm displeased with the recommendation of ranking all 36 AT-CTI schools from 10 to 40. 10 meaning no simulators while 40 equates to simulators in both terminal and en-route. This puts many CTI programs in the dust while more wealthy schools such as Embry-Riddle cash in. Do you find it ironic that Dr. Tim Brady, who is the Dean of the School of Aviation at Embry Riddle, is one of the authors of this recommendation panel?


Here is a link to the PDF:

http://www.faa.gov/news/updates/media/IRP Report on Selection Assignment Training of ATCS FINAL 20110922.pdf

I am urging my fellow AT-CTI students at Vaughn in writing letters to our Congressmen to appeal this "simulator-school ranking" by the FAA. Hopefully other CTI schools will join in this appeal as well.
I am eager to hear what the Stuck Mic Community thinks about this.



"Obstacles don't have to stop you. If you run into a wall, don't turn around and give up. Figure out how to climb it, go through it, or work around it."
--- Michael Jordon
 

deltahotel

Rookie
Nov 2, 2010
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I also heard that on top of this that you will not know your facility until you pass the academy, then your academy grade and all the previous rankings and scores you mentioned will determine where you will be placed.
 

rhd9b

Trusted Contributor
Dec 24, 2009
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Keep in mind that these were just recommendations. A lot of them make sense, but there's no reason to believe anything will actually be done with this document.
 

deltahotel

Rookie
Nov 2, 2010
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Keep in mind that these were just recommendations. A lot of them make sense, but there's no reason to believe anything will actually be done with this document.
Good point who knows if any of these will be put into action let alone when they will be.
 

UNDgrad06

Epic Member
Dec 8, 2010
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There is already a few threads about this report. I would suggest reading them. This will probably never happen anyway. They might implement a thing or two but even if it does happen it will be a bunch of years down the road.
 

meadelz

Senior Member
Mar 10, 2009
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CCBC is by no means rich, but it is among the best. Reputation has more to do with it than money! Just sayen.
 

rhd9b

Trusted Contributor
Dec 24, 2009
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I'm sorry but Vaughn sucked. It didn't prepare me at all for the academy.
Who's fault is that though? The student who chose to pay Vaughn thousands of dollars to get the degree, or the school's? The problem with the system they are suggesting is they're going to be punishing students for something that was out of their control. If they start "grading" schools on a 1-4 scale, they need to disclose those grades to prospective students so they know what they are getting themselves into before they decide to attend a particular school.

I would be LIVID if I found out now that my CTI degree from Vaughn wasn't worth as much as someone's CTI degree from Riddle because of new policy/findings that came out after I completed the degree.
 

spades

What's happening?
Apr 20, 2009
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Who's fault is that though? The student who chose to pay Vaughn thousands of dollars to get the degree, or the school's? The problem with the system they are suggesting is they're going to be punishing students for something that was out of their control. If they start "grading" schools on a 1-4 scale, they need to disclose those grades to prospective students so they know what they are getting themselves into before they decide to attend a particular school.

I would be LIVID if I found out now that my CTI degree from Vaughn wasn't worth as much as someone's CTI degree from Riddle because of new policy/findings that came out after I completed the degree.
I agree that they should disclose that type of information. However, it doesn't change the fact that schools like Vaughn do not prepare you. A guy who went to Beaver in my class was already familiar with just about everything we went over. I had to learn it from scratch.

It's not even just Vaughn's CTI program that sucks. The whole school sucks. I had a BBA from Georgia State before I went to Vaughn. It is like night & day between the two schools. At Georgia State, I had to really work in every class I took. When I made the Dean's List at GSU, I really felt like that was something to be proud of. Vaughn was such a joke I was actually embarrassed when I saw my grades because I knew how easy they were to get to begin with.

I genuinely hate it when guys at work ask me what CTI school I went to. It is so uncomfortable and I usually just end up saying, "I went to Vaughn, I don't recommend it, but at least it got me the job."
 

rhd9b

Trusted Contributor
Dec 24, 2009
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I agree that they should disclose that type of information. However, it doesn't change the fact that schools like Vaughn do not prepare you. A guy who went to Beaver in my class was already familiar with just about everything we went over. I had to learn it from scratch.

It's not even just Vaughn's CTI program that sucks. The whole school sucks. I had a BBA from Georgia State before I went to Vaughn. It is like night & day between the two schools. At Georgia State, I had to really work in every class I took. When I made the Dean's List at GSU, I really felt like that was something to be proud of. Vaughn was such a joke I was actually embarrassed when I saw my grades because I knew how easy they were to get to begin with.

I genuinely hate it when guys at work ask me what CTI school I went to. It is so uncomfortable and I usually just end up saying, "I went to Vaughn, I don't recommend it, but at least it got me the job."
I understand and agree entirely. I did my undergraduate work at University of Virginia and Vaughn was a joke in comparison. I think a lot of people (including myself) just look at it as a means to an end because they offer the program quickly and online if you want it. For someone like me who doesn't live near a CTI school and works full time, that's really the best option.
 

SCOPED

Senior Analyst
Nov 21, 2010
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I'm sorry but Vaughn sucked. It didn't prepare me at all for the academy.
I went to a great CTI school and I realize now that i'm at the academy that it was not that much help. Everything is done so different at ZAE and I used the same airspace at CTI. I feel like I should have got more from school but I agree it is nice to bust your ass and get good grades than just skate through. Hope your rockin it out spades
 

Rosstafari

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Aug 17, 2008
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Writing Congressmembers isn't going to do anything. They don't deal with specifics like ranking CTI schools or making hiring policy. It's not their role and they don't have the expertise to make those decisions even if they wanted to.

The FAA is who decides which, if any, of the recommendations made will be implemented and in which form. If you're interested in helping form policy, participate in NATCA or work towards the management positions which deal with that. As a CTI grad who doesn't even have the job -- don't take this personally -- your opinion doesn't mean anything to the FAA.
 

Naomi

Newcomer
Apr 12, 2011
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I'm sorry to say this but embry riddle deserves to get a higher rating than any other cti school. They put money into making their facility the best, and the instructors and curriculum actually teach you practical skills to take with you to the academy and on to your atc career.

And I didn't even go to embry for cti. I went to broward college, which is a great cti school with new enroute, radar and tower simulator labs with current software used at actual FAA facilities. I did my research, earned my degree from a well qualified school and did it for free.

Maybe you should of done some research beforehand.
 

556mm

Junior Member
Dec 8, 2010
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I agree with the proposal. How can a school with simulators be weighted equally with one that doesn't?

Any other type of college has their programs ranked, why shouldn't CTI programs? I did my research beforehand and decided NOT to go with Vaughn for the sole reason that there are no sims.
 

deltabravo89

Senior Analyst
Mar 11, 2010
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CTI school doesn't prepare you for this. Rules and regs change daily here, it's always gonna be done a different way. CTI school gets you a golden ticket to the academy, plain and simple. I guess some people just won't understand that until they are actually here in OKC. Bicker all you want, that's how it is, and I know plenty of academy students and grads will back this theory up.
 

deltabravo89

Senior Analyst
Mar 11, 2010
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I'm sorry to say this but embry riddle deserves to get a higher rating than any other cti school. They put money into making their facility the best, and the instructors and curriculum actually teach you practical skills to take with you to the academy and on to your atc career.

And I didn't even go to embry for cti. I went to broward college, which is a great cti school with new enroute, radar and tower simulator labs with current software used at actual FAA facilities. I did my research, earned my degree from a well qualified school and did it for free.

Maybe you should of done some research beforehand.
Did they pay you to say that? Geeze, you sweat Erau and you didn't even go there. And also, the guy who said he went to Vaughn, is now at his facility. ( see you soon spades)
 

RFDATM

Trusted Contributor
Nov 27, 2009
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CTI school doesn't prepare you for this. Rules and regs change daily here, it's always gonna be done a different way. CTI school gets you a golden ticket to the academy, plain and simple. I guess some people just won't understand that until they are actually here in OKC. Bicker all you want, that's how it is, and I know plenty of academy students and grads will back this theory up.

Wrong - CTI allows you to apply for the job and join the many pool of candidates - check the stats - CTI has been about 35% of new hires
 

rhd9b

Trusted Contributor
Dec 24, 2009
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Wrong - CTI allows you to apply for the job and join the many pool of candidates - check the stats - CTI has been about 35% of new hires
That may be historically true, but I think everyone expects that statistic to rise at this point. There are a lot more CTI candidates to choose from now that there are more schools, they are no longer accepting OTS bids, and there has been a lot of talk about making better use of the CTI program since so much money has been invested in it (this is brought up in the document that sparked this thread, among other places).