Comparison of BQ Answers

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Jax

Senior Analyst
Nov 17, 2010
869
32
28
N90-EWR
I hope this doesn't come across as me calling your coworker or his nephew and son a liar, but I'm suspicious about these claims that x number of people got together and answered this questionnaire the same way.

A.) Beforehand, who would've thought that the questionnaire would eliminate so many people. Therefore, how many people would have thought to get together and answer the questionnaire exactly the same way to have an argument afterward. Did people get together to complete the questionnaire simultaneously, and maybe even discuss or agree on certain answers to some questions? Most likely yes. Did people get together and answer every question exactly the same way? I am highly skeptical of that.

B.) The questionnaire contained something like 60 questions with five possible responses each, right? Using this example, that means there are 5^60 possible ways to answer the questionnaire (sometimes it helps to see the raw number: 867,361,737,988,404,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000). The random likelihood that just two people would answer the questionnaire exactly the same is astronomical. That several people (I think one post on here mentioned four) would answer the questionnaire the same, fugget about it. If exactly the same answers to the questionnaire were turned in, I'm sure the computer's WTF alarm would go off. What happens then, I don't know.

While I remain skeptical, I apologize in advance if I am wrong and some applicants did turn in the exact same questionnaire.
All 3 of them were sitting together when they did it.
 

Special_K

Senior Member
Jun 16, 2008
210
0
16
This would mean there is an equally likely chance of any answer being chosen. Clearly that is not the case since some questions show for example (200 answered b and 0 answered d). Not that i disagree with your premise but the possibility of it happening are not quite so astronomical.
You make a valid point. Some combinations will be more frequent than others among a population, and hence why it is believed by the FAA that such a test has predictive ability in determining who will be successful in ATC training. If it was truly random there would obviously be no predictive value. Nevertheless, approaching the question from randomness is where you would first start, and then you could weigh things differently as more data is obtained. But you are right, the likelihood of the questionnaire being answered exactly the same is somewhat greater than what true randomness would suggest. I'm missing far too much info to calculate that (and don't even care to do so), so I went with the starting point of basic probability.
 
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Special_K

Senior Member
Jun 16, 2008
210
0
16
All 3 of them were sitting together when they did it.
By all three I assume you mean your coworker, his son, and his nephew, correct? Fair enough. I have no problem admitting my mistake.

It makes me very curious to see how this questionnaire is scored and measured then. I suspect questionnaires with the exact same answers would get flagged by the system, so I wonder where it goes from there.
 

duranme

Senior Analyst
Nov 3, 2009
920
13
18
BUR
After reading some of those answers I can say that the popular answer for some of those questions weeded out who is and isn't a current controller.

Kind of almost validated the bio-q but still it's a stupid process/screen
 

duranme

Senior Analyst
Nov 3, 2009
920
13
18
BUR
Oh come on, "why do you want to be a controller" question... top answer:

"I'll be constantly challenged to resolve situations which arise"

Jeeze... lamest answer ever.
 

duranme

Senior Analyst
Nov 3, 2009
920
13
18
BUR
Examples? Honestly curious.
1 -How would you describe your ideal job? (Top answer: ability to decide for myself...)
You will be trained to do it one way, with some slight variations allowed, but you will never reinvent the wheel. you do it the way youre taught because thats the way it works, thats the way its been done, deviate from the standard way and it will throw people for a loop in the cab or radar room.

2 -In the past, what did you do when you were working on something and nothing seemed to go right? (Top answer: took the day as it came, remained upbeat)
I dont know one controller in my 9yrs (3 usaf, 5 faa) that didnt voice their frustrations after missing a hole, being late on a turn to final, or missing a traffic call. But ces la vie, you wouldnt necessarily be "angry" but you let others know and show your "tell" of being frustrated and keep working waiting for your turn to go on break to vent to whoever else is on break.

3 - It takes hard work and persistence to be an outstanding employee on most jobs. (Answered by 81%)
Time. In this career its time thats important. (And a little bit of who you know). Hard work and persistence is great and all but you need to experience things on position to get better, its not all bookwork and studying, its seeing it and responding to it.

4 - People who know me would say that when things go wrong I... (top answers: extreme tolerance / good balance of frustration and calm)
Sure, cotton candy answer and id have picked "get frustrated when things go very wrong". But I can not stand errors. I get frustrated on myself for doing something wrong, if I waste a hole on the intersection, if I miss a turn to final, if my trainee forgets to ensure an ATIS. We will never be perfect, its impossible. And it bleed over into life outside of work and it will suck.
 
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Juan Valdez

Rookie
Mar 12, 2014
69
1
8
I like how current FAA controllers who took the test for a chuckle were rejected. Guess they aren't FAA material.

What's really flawed about this test is that its what people "say" they are. How do you self evaluate your aggression anyways? You may be aggressive with getting work done but passive and non-confrontation socially.

I wonder if some those who were selected just faded what they thought were a popular answer and in tie-break situations went against the grain. A smart tactic going up against 28,000.
 
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romo

Newcomer
Mar 2, 2014
1
0
1
So I cannot find the results that you are talking about. If they were posted on page 9 I am not allowed to navigate to it for whatever reason. Could someone send me the results please?
 

dlk2

Newcomer
Jul 5, 2012
1
0
1
Yeah, so pretty much the dude who collected all the responses now has a pretty package of surveys taken by people who both passed and didn't pass, but all we get to see is the results of BOTH groups added together? That's meaningless to me.

Post the results separately for those who passed and those who didn't pass. Otherwise these results are meaningless.
 

Truth

Senior Member
Jun 22, 2011
176
0
16
really need to separate those who "passed" and those that did not for this to be worth anything but toilet paper..

Not knowing who passed, looking at the responses I'd say I failed for being military with an IFR rating..
 

BravoQ

Newcomer
Feb 28, 2014
6
0
1
All,

I have recently been contacted by some people in regards to this comparison of BQ answers. I can't go into too much detail about the situation, but will not be publishing any further information on the data that has been collected. The information has not been distributed to anyone or seen by anyone buy myself. Everything has been deleted.

I deeply apologize for wasting all of your time and had hoped to help everyone. This account will no longer be in use and no further updates will be made on this thread.
 

AK02

Senior Member
Apr 8, 2012
157
9
18
Haha, I don't understand how anyone thought this was a good idea in the first place.
 
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MrJBGibson

Senior Member
Nov 14, 2012
153
0
16
Done. I answered more honestly though:/
More honestly? That's how you're SUPPOSED to answer., I passed and got selected because I was apparently honest and consistent? Why wouldn't you be honest? That's not what the FAA is looking for- a fake
 

psykomagician

Junior Member
Jan 10, 2014
114
8
18
Also I always thought it was illegal to ask questions about race on a job application, but I'm not 100% on that.
The federal government is required to ASK for voluntary self-disclosure of race, sex, etc. for statistical purposes only. However, merit principles prohibit the use of race, sex, etc. in making (or not making) any personnel decision or action.

An example of statistical analysis would be analyzing the pass rate on the BioQ by sex. If women passed the BioQ at less than 80% of the pass rate for men, then that could be considered evidence of disparate impact under the Uniform Guidelines on Employee Selection Procedures (29 CFR 1607). Such a finding (uncovered, for example, in the course of discovery for a Title VII class action lawsuit) would be the basis for making a prima facie case of illegal discrimination in employment on the basis of race. The prima facie case is the 1st hurdle the plaintiff/complainant has to clear in a Title VII case. No prima facie case, the suit dies.

Oh, a failure to keep such records (of voluntary disclosures of sex, race, etc.) can be taken by fact-finders as evidence of discrimination (see 29 CFR 1607 "Where the user has not maintained data on adverse impact as required by the documentation section of applicable guidelines, the Federal enforcement agencies may draw an inference of adverse impact of the selection process from the failure of the user to maintain such data,"
http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=8ec60b8af473bfc87af895a5895e44fc&node=29:4.1.4.1.8.0.21.4&rgn=div8
 
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