July 27th 2018 OTS Bid Announcement

steiner19

Newcomer
Jan 11, 2017
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0
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That's what I was looking for, yes. I was guessing that there was still one last legitimate hurdle. However, others, including my friend in the business, have said you take care of the physical and psych evals before the TOL, which would make sense - they probably want to make sure you're fit for the position before an offer is extended, yeah? I was wondering if we should be looking for any emails to have that stuff set up or not.


You get TOL then do the evaluations, the TOL is a tentative on you passing your evaluations. After you do the evaluations and exams then you get an actual offer of employment or something along the lines of a final offer which is the real one.
 

jayrod

Rookie
Jan 2, 2018
70
1
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That's what I was looking for, yes. I was guessing that there was still one last legitimate hurdle. However, others, including my friend in the business, have said you take care of the physical and psych evals before the TOL, which would make sense - they probably want to make sure you're fit for the position before an offer is extended, yeah? I was wondering if we should be looking for any emails to have that stuff set up or not.
You will only begin your medical process if they deem you qualified enough through a TOL. You will not have to take any actions until they reach out to you with a TOL which has a long list of steps you need to do which includes medical and background.
 

KTreu42

Newcomer
Jun 28, 2018
14
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No, you get the TOL then do your medical and security clearance. Then, if you pass those you get your FOL(firm offer letter). There is nothing to do until you get your TOL.
I see. So it's like a pro sports acquisition. "Approved, pending physical."

Is this the stage where the selection process is no longer automated? I'm hoping my education level and references actually come into play now, since up until this point, the filtering is all based on explicit criteria and scores.
 

randoturbo33

Rookie
Sep 19, 2017
66
1
8
I see. So it's like a pro sports acquisition. "Approved, pending physical."

Is this the stage where the selection process is no longer automated? I'm hoping my education level and references actually come into play now, since up until this point, the filtering is all based on explicit criteria and scores.
Nope. Everyone who scored above a 69.99% on the AT-SA, which is probably a high percentage of total test-takers, got the same exact "Referred" message. However, when it comes time to send out TOLs, they'll just start with whoever scored the highest and work their way down. There are some other factors that come into it, such as veterans preference, but for the most part your future now rests entirely on your AT-SA score - there's zero subjectivity involved.
 

tncnews

Rookie
Dec 28, 2017
58
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Anyone have numbers on how many people ended up taking the ATSA/got referred? Hopefully lower numbers this year mean a higher chance of getting a TOL. :)
 

KTreu42

Newcomer
Jun 28, 2018
14
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Nope. Everyone who scored above a 69.99% on the AT-SA, which is probably a high percentage of total test-takers, got the same exact "Referred" message. However, when it comes time to send out TOLs, they'll just start with whoever scored the highest and work their way down. There are some other factors that come into it, such as veterans preference, but for the most part your future now rests entirely on your AT-SA score - there's zero subjectivity involved.
Seems like a poor method... basing selection entirely on numbers, where someone could have scored 10% on the radar sim, but 90% on everything else, and passed. I mean, what was the point of submitting an application and resume besides proving you had the work/education minimums, if a robot is deciding everything the whole way?
 

JayTango

Junior Member
Feb 21, 2016
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Seems like a poor method... basing selection entirely on numbers, where someone could have scored 10% on the radar sim, but 90% on everything else, and passed. I mean, what was the point of submitting an application and resume besides proving you had the work/education minimums, if a robot is deciding everything the whole way?
How else is it suppose to be decided if not on test scores?
I agree that the ATSA was a weird ass test and the collision section and the simple math section of the test was the only thing I recall being something that was somewhat relevant to actual ATC. The position relation portion too. But it’s the only thing they have to weed some people out and it’s an even playing field since everyone has to go through the same process.
 

KTreu42

Newcomer
Jun 28, 2018
14
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Just feels like higher education in relevant fields, or references in the FAA, for example, should carry at least a little weight. As you said, not all elements of the ATSA seemed strictly relevant to the job, so if the test is scored as a whole, it may not be as telling as it seems.
 

KTreu42

Newcomer
Jun 28, 2018
14
0
1
You must be new here....
I mean, you can see my single-digit (big jump to double, with this one) post numbers. Very astute.

I get it, it's government. They aren't going to do anything effectively. I'm still going to mention flaws as I see them.
 

boots

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2017
261
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I don't see the flaws. Just because you have a degree in anything doesn't mean you can separate airplanes.
 

kshaky

Newcomer
Oct 26, 2018
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I don't see the flaws. Just because you have a degree in anything doesn't mean you can separate airplanes.
To play devil's advocate . . . Just because you get a high score on the ATSA doesn't mean you can separate airplanes. I can follow an argument depending on what degree one has, one may be more inclined to be better than another at separating airplanes. I am not saying or suggesting I know what degrees are such or that this should be a part of the application process.

Something I am interested to know . . . for Pool 1 applicants are the points added to veterans scores done before referral or after. Basically, are veterans (lets assume 10 point veterans) who score 60-69 referred and when ranking for TOLs their scores are 70-79 or are veterans scores only 80 and above? If it is the former that seems like a flaw to me.
 

Skykid91

Rookie
Jun 1, 2018
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To play devil's advocate . . . Just because you get a high score on the ATSA doesn't mean you can separate airplanes. I can follow an argument depending on what degree one has, one may be more inclined to be better than another at separating airplanes. I am not saying or suggesting I know what degrees are such or that this should be a part of the application process.

Something I am interested to know . . . for Pool 1 applicants are the points added to veterans scores done before referral or after. Basically, are veterans (lets assume 10 point veterans) who score 60-69 referred and when ranking for TOLs their scores are 70-79 or are veterans scores only 80 and above? If it is the former that seems like a flaw to me.
We don't know how the ATSA is graded. If anything the FAA makes judgement calls on who is most likely to pass training.
 

calebmt

Newcomer
Oct 6, 2018
5
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Does anyone know why there was a second "Open to public" application on 12/03 - 12/09 ?? Did not enough people pass the July bid? Just wondering.
 

MikleBrady

Senior Member
Mar 20, 2013
284
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Does anyone know why there was a second "Open to public" application on 12/03 - 12/09 ?? Did not enough people pass the July bid? Just wondering.
It's a previous experience bid

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

Wsurocks12

Newcomer
Oct 14, 2017
3
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Im new here. Passed the ATSA my second time around. Received A referral for Pool 2. "Your applications is among those being reviewed." Is there a good chance for a TOL or should I be a little worried?

If a TOL is offered and I take/pass all the pre-employment tests, etc... When is a guesstimate of a start date in OKC?

I appreciate any help! and best of luck to you all:)
 

randoturbo33

Rookie
Sep 19, 2017
66
1
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Im new here. Passed the ATSA my second time around. Received A referral for Pool 2. "Your applications is among those being reviewed." Is there a good chance for a TOL or should I be a little worried?

If a TOL is offered and I take/pass all the pre-employment tests, etc... When is a guesstimate of a start date in OKC?

I appreciate any help! and best of luck to you all:)
That's the same message that everyone got. Generally speaking, the people who scored highest on the ATSA will receive TOLs - but unfortunately, there's no way to know how you actually scored. Statistically speaking, less than half of people who were Referred will likely receive TOLs, so just going by that the odds aren't in your favor.

If you do get a TOL, there's no way to know when you'd get to OKC. I got my class date about 30 days after my TOL, which was extremely fast compared to normal - however the next available class for me wasn't until almost 3 months later, which is a more typical timeline. If you require additional evaluation for any reason, through no fault of your own, your timeline could quickly stretch to a year or more. I believe there are still people from the 2016 bid still awaiting class dates.

So yeah. No way to tell. Don't make any life decisions based on the FAA until you have a FOL in hand.