Privatization Battle

nhstadt

Epic Member
Mar 24, 2011
2,980
57
48
south "Murica
Lowapproach, you are absolutely correct-I washed from my first facility, as do about what? 75 percent of the people who walk in the door there? So sure thanks NATCA for having a part in that. You in particular I guess, with your holier than thou attitude.
aside from that, From what I've seen on a local and national level ranges from Natca is a bunch of political flip flops and double speak (privatization) to outright hurting career progression of employees (NCEPT) to the inability to actually do anything when it comes to SERIOUS working condition issues (had to file an IG complaint do to harassment from a temp flm).

The government is gonna do what the government is going to do and Natca will change its stance accordingly and feign caring for individual BUEs so long as they keep getting that dues money.

And as as far as my "precious career" goes.... your goddamn right it's precious to me, it's how I put food on the table, and afford to do the stuff I'd actually like to be doing instead of working, and here in the good ole us of a cash is king. Your piddly 1.6 percent raises you want me to bow down and individually suck off every individual member of Natca for is tiddlywinks compared to what I'm losing by Natca supporting a policy that blocks my career progression.
 

SayAgain3

Trusted Member
Feb 13, 2017
359
5
18
That we are at a 27-year low for CPCs NAS-wide or the FAA missed its hiring goal seven years running are just incidental to NATCA :p:p:p:p:p:p:p the Little Guy Who Pays Dues, I guess.
I'm well aware of that fact and how it makes the NCEPT and NATCA's involvement more egregious then it already is. NATCA agreed to let it's members suffer the consequences of the FAA's missed hiring goals and put a system in place that gives the FAA an unprecedented advantage to fill their managerial positions.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrewnATC

nhstadt

Epic Member
Mar 24, 2011
2,980
57
48
south "Murica
I'm well aware of that fact and how it makes the NCEPT and NATCA's involvement more egregious then it already is. NATCA agreed to let it's members suffer the consequences of the FAA's missed hiring goals and put a system in place that gives the FAA an unprecedented advantage to fill their managerial positions.

HERETIC!!!! How dare are you question the NCEPT mou! Don't you know Natca fought really really hard for comp time? You should be spending less time complaining about your livelihood and career apsirations and more time thinking about the white book days and being thankful!

YOUR WELCOME SAYAGAIN3 FOR THE BOUNTIFUL GIFTS WHICH WE RECEIVE IN MYSTERIOUS WAYS FROM GLORIOUS NATCA. THE FATHER, THE SON AND THE HOLY 1.6 PERCENT RAISE, RINALDI AMEN.
 

DaOsprey

Trusted Member
Mar 25, 2014
490
8
18
HERETIC!!!! How dare are you question the NCEPT mou! Don't you know Natca fought really really hard for comp time? You should be spending less time complaining about your livelihood and career apsirations and more time thinking about the white book days and being thankful!

YOUR WELCOME SAYAGAIN3 FOR THE BOUNTIFUL GIFTS WHICH WE RECEIVE IN MYSTERIOUS WAYS FROM GLORIOUS NATCA. THE FATHER, THE SON AND THE HOLY 1.6 PERCENT RAISE, RINALDI AMEN.
I love this.
 

lowapproach

Epic Member
Oct 29, 2010
1,316
33
48
WV
I'm well aware of that fact and how it makes the NCEPT and NATCA's involvement more egregious then it already is. NATCA agreed to let it's members suffer the consequences of the FAA's missed hiring goals and put a system in place that gives the FAA an unprecedented advantage to fill their managerial positions.
How does NCEPT give the FAA "an unprecedented advantage" to fill their managerial positions? Temporary FLMs are subject to the NRP just like anyone else, and it's not like the FAA had a problem pushing back ERRs before the MOU because they wanted to promote somebody.
 

SayAgain3

Trusted Member
Feb 13, 2017
359
5
18
How does NCEPT give the FAA "an unprecedented advantage" to fill their managerial positions? Temporary FLMs are subject to the NRP just like anyone else, and it's not like the FAA had a problem pushing back ERRs before the MOU because they wanted to promote somebody.
Temp SUPs are not subject to the national release policy in the same way CPCs are. Their rules are diagrammed in section 4.0 of the NCEPT SOP, most notably section 4.1.4 where if current FLM % is lower then current CPC%, they do not have to file a waiver. Unless you work at a center, a waiver will almost never be needed in this situation. Even in the unlikelihood that they encounter someone who is ineligible, they can simply file a waiver to bypass the NRP and over 50% are granted. CPCs who wish to ERR do not have the ability to file a waiver.
361 days a year 100% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility. 4 days a year over 99% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility.
The agency can pull CPCs into managerial position 365 days a year and as diagrammed above can circumnavigate the NRP to do it. THAT is an unprecedented advantage.
 

lowapproach

Epic Member
Oct 29, 2010
1,316
33
48
WV
Temp SUPs are not subject to the national release policy in the same way CPCs are. Their rules are diagrammed in section 4.0 of the NCEPT SOP, most notably section 4.1.4 where if current FLM % is lower then current CPC%, they do not have to file a waiver. Unless you work at a center, a waiver will almost never be needed in this situation. Even in the unlikelihood that they encounter someone who is ineligible, they can simply file a waiver to bypass the NRP and over 50% are granted. CPCs who wish to ERR do not have the ability to file a waiver.
Previously, the FAA could and did promote whenever they wanted, regardless of staffing, whereas now they actually need to prove that the FLM numbers are proportionally lower than CPC numbers to promote from within. That said, I can understand why a CPC working at a small tower at the national staffing average would call this a distinction without a difference.
 

nhstadt

Epic Member
Mar 24, 2011
2,980
57
48
south "Murica
Temp SUPs are not subject to the national release policy in the same way CPCs are. Their rules are diagrammed in section 4.0 of the NCEPT SOP, most notably section 4.1.4 where if current FLM % is lower then current CPC%, they do not have to file a waiver. Unless you work at a center, a waiver will almost never be needed in this situation. Even in the unlikelihood that they encounter someone who is ineligible, they can simply file a waiver to bypass the NRP and over 50% are granted. CPCs who wish to ERR do not have the ability to file a waiver.
361 days a year 100% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility. 4 days a year over 99% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility.
The agency can pull CPCs into managerial position 365 days a year and as diagrammed above can circumnavigate the NRP to do it. THAT is an unprecedented advantage.
This just happened at my facility. We released 1 controller on the first NCEPT, crickets since, all the while begging and pleading with the FAA to get us controllers so we could get up to meet the NCEPT's magic spreadsheet numbers. Mind you my facility has gotten nothing but washouts and hardships in 8 years. That's right, level 5 tower great place to train a new controller, we have not gotten a fresh academy grad in 8 years. we recently got a previous exp new hire, first one my facility has had. So we finally get a guy checked out to put us above nat'l average, and what's the first thing that happens? we release a controller to go be a supe at a center..... not in three months, or six months, but at the next unpublished pay period.

And if we are so worried about CONTROLLER staffing NAS-wide, why the hell is it we are releasing controllers to go be supes in the first place, but moving from one facility to another and retaining that controller as a controller is so bad?

To make matters worse, our numbers were not updated via KSN before the cutoff date (management's fault), the FAA side of the house is assuring us they will be changed in part due to it being a screw up on their side, its NATCA telling my rep in essence "too bad". So ya explain that one to me while you are at it. So ya, that whole "we can drop one below the nat'l average yay" stuff.....not really helping us here.
 

Jax

Senior Analyst
Nov 17, 2010
869
32
28
N90-EWR
Rumor has it that at the most short staffed sector, in the most short staffed facility, a CPC will soon be promoted to a supe job, so yeah....
 

Stinger

Epic Member
May 24, 2009
1,563
22
38
Temp SUPs are not subject to the national release policy in the same way CPCs are. Their rules are diagrammed in section 4.0 of the NCEPT SOP, most notably section 4.1.4 where if current FLM % is lower then current CPC%, they do not have to file a waiver. Unless you work at a center, a waiver will almost never be needed in this situation. Even in the unlikelihood that they encounter someone who is ineligible, they can simply file a waiver to bypass the NRP and over 50% are granted. CPCs who wish to ERR do not have the ability to file a waiver.
361 days a year 100% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility. 4 days a year over 99% of CPCs cannot ERR to another facility.
The agency can pull CPCs into managerial position 365 days a year and as diagrammed above can circumnavigate the NRP to do it. THAT is an unprecedented advantage.
I had about 10 deviations denied when different facilities tried to pick me up over the course of 4 months.
 

SayAgain3

Trusted Member
Feb 13, 2017
359
5
18
I had about 10 deviations denied when different facilities tried to pick me up over the course of 4 months.
But that 11th one though right ;)

I know the staffing situation is pretty rough at your facility, regardless, getting selected for 11 FLM jobs in a 4 month period has to be some kind of record.
 

Stinger

Epic Member
May 24, 2009
1,563
22
38
But that 11th one though right ;)

I know the staffing situation is pretty rough at your facility, regardless, getting selected for 11 FLM jobs in a 4 month period has to be some kind of record.
The staffing there is improving with the influx of previous experience hires the last 12 months.
I had to say no to that 1 facility that managed a deviation since I had signed a TOL for another spot that would give better opportunities down the road (hopefully!)
 

Daedalus

Rookie
Apr 6, 2017
41
0
6
In Trump's newest budget proposal named: A New Foundation For American Greatness, he aims to turn Air Traffic Control to "non-profit, non-government entity"

Relevant excerpt:

"The United States has maintained an excellent aviation safety record while operating the world’s most congested airspace. Despite this record,the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)is challenged increasingly to address the quickly evolving needs of the Nation’s airspace users.

To accommodate growing air traffic volume and meet the demands of aviation users, the Administration proposes to shift the air traffic control functions to a non-profit, non-governmental entity. Similar efforts have been undertaken successfully in many other countries. This transformative undertaking will create an innovative corporation that can more nimbly respond to the demand for air traffic services, all while reducing taxes and Government spending. The parts of FAA that will remain with the Government will retain important aviation safety regulatory activities as well as maintain the Airport Improvement Program grant program.

The Budget reflects the proposal to shift the air traffic control function to an independent,non-governmental organization beginning in 2021, with a cap reduction in discretionary spending of $72.8 billion, and reduction in aviation excise taxes of $115.6 billion. These estimated changes represent a high-level reflection of the Administration’s proposal."

You can read the full proposed plan here: https://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/whitehouse.gov/files/omb/budget/fy2018/budget.pdf
 

SMS

Trusted Member
Oct 28, 2014
397
2
18
Shuster's Bill, HR 2997, could be up for a vote on the floor of the House next week. Now is the time call, not write, your House Rep and tell them to vote no.

We don't want this to go to conference with the Senate's clean reauthorization, no telling what the final bill will look like if that happens. A sound defeat of 2997 on the floor of the House will send a much better signal than the last time around when it just quietly died after getting out of committee.