Stall Pattern

spades

What's happening?
Apr 20, 2009
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I know you've been trying to get back in for quite a while. If you don't mind me asking...why did you leave? I'm just curious.
 

jamisjockey

Banned
Jan 10, 2010
2,834
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I know you've been trying to get back in for quite a while. If you don't mind me asking...why did you leave? I'm just curious.
Family reasons. My wife is/was running a successful business and was pretty much at her breaking point. As much as I love the job, the income is pretty much a fixed path. My kids were very young, both under 3 years old and my wife was pretty much about to have a nervous breakdown.
Things are much more stable now, kids are older, wife is wiser, and the economy sucks. Having that anchor, retirement, and of course returning to a job that I enjoy are high priorities for me.
 
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charliezuluatc

Guest
Been told by my higher ups that Advanced Hiring Plan that goes in effect will be very good for people like you, but however it's going to be bad for the schools. Also been told that 10 colleges have seeked approval to start CTI programs and been told no.
 
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SirMario

Senior Analyst
Apr 15, 2010
809
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Been told by my higher ups that Advanced Hiring Plan that goes in effect will be very good for people like you, but however it's going to be bad for the schools. Also been told that 10 colleges have seeked approval to start CTI programs and been told no.
I see, when will this new plan go into effect?
 

jamisjockey

Banned
Jan 10, 2010
2,834
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Been told by my higher ups that Advanced Hiring Plan that goes in effect will be very good for people like you, but however it's going to be bad for the schools. Also been told that 10 colleges have seeked approval to start CTI programs and been told no.
That would be good. I ain't getting any younger.
 
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charliezuluatc

Guest
Sometime between Jan-Sept, the schools are fighting what is known, but when the agency wants something, it gets it.
 

NovaZDC

Trusted Member
Apr 8, 2009
414
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Anyone know any specifics of the FAAs new hiring plans? I've also had interest in a possible reinstate.
 

SirMario

Senior Analyst
Apr 15, 2010
809
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Sometime between Jan-Sept, the schools are fighting what is known, but when the agency wants something, it gets it.
Being very vauge, does this also affect the CTI individuals who are waiting for panels, or does it include them as well, also if this is the new plan and we are on the same page, it will take into effect for CTI announcements GPA values and you would get points for that...
 

nhstadt

Epic Member
Mar 24, 2011
2,980
57
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south "Murica
They want to do away with the CTI all together.

I know this is going to get some criticism from you cti students but I was told that the OPM had issued a statement to the FAA stating that the practice of hiring cti grads was equivalent to hiring with "experience" because you need this to get hired. When in reality, the announcements and pay-bands are supposed to be set for people to be hired with zero "experience".

The end product at the academy, regardless of cti or off the street hire, is the same.
Let the CTI shitstorm begin.... But ya the CTI thing is ridiculous. BTW unable, what part of Arkansas you in?
 

SirMario

Senior Analyst
Apr 15, 2010
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Well actually currently CTI and OTS is the same, the pay grade is the same 17k if i am not mistaken...But you have OTS and CTI, CTI will have a little more knowledge of the system...think about it...and NHS is just upset it took him 14 panels to get a TOL ;D giggity
 

nhstadt

Epic Member
Mar 24, 2011
2,980
57
48
south "Murica
Well actually currently CTI and OTS is the same, the pay grade is the same 17k if i am not mistaken...But you have OTS and CTI, CTI will have a little more knowledge of the system...think about it...and NHS is just upset it took him 14 panels to get a TOL ;D giggity
Nah, Hey, if you CTI guys are OK with getting robbed blind (especially you riddle guys), that's cool by me broheim. I just think its jacked up how much you guys pay for.... basically nothing. The whole thing is a scam as far as I am concerned.
 

SirMario

Senior Analyst
Apr 15, 2010
809
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I see that as well, but i took the route of a big scholarship so that does not apply to me, believe me when i tell you, if i had to pay for it at 100-120k gtfo!!!! lol...would have gone military, i also agree one should have something else to fall upon in case this does not work out well.. And i also can tell you, i know the map thats being thought at OKC in and out ...so there are some advantages compared to OTS...should be like this VRA-CTO,CTI - OTS... and anyone that disagrees usually has a biased opinion...

But then again, keep in mind, some people have the money and they can afford it, its their right, whether you and i like it or not... lol
 

phillyman2633

Epic Member
May 13, 2010
4,205
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International waters
www.drudgereport.com
I just think its jacked up how much you guys pay for.... basically nothing. The whole thing is a scam as far as I am concerned.
We're not paying for nothing...if we are able to gain employment and make money, that is called a return. If OTS bids were held on a regular basis, CTI would be useless, but as the FAA set up the CTI program, they at some point had to have made a calculated decision to stop the OTS hires and basically hire CTI/VRA (not counting DoD, reinstates, etc...). I would agree that the price for Riddle is high, wahh wahh and so on and so forth, but really, if I get hired in the next 2 years, I will be making over $100k/year by the time I am 30, so in the long run, I would say the investment was worth it. If I had to do it over again, yes, I would go somewhere cheaper if I knew I wouldn't be flying as a career and was going ATC.

For what it's worth, I think the CTI program is a sham, but those of us who graduated weren't told that the CTI schools were pumping 8,000 people into a field that only needed 4,000 people. It's not the CTI schools that f'd up the CTI program (that's called capitalism), it's the FAA's fault for failing to regulate the influx. When the FAA only used to put out OTS bids, tens of thousands of people applied and only a few hundred were selected at a time, a tiny fraction, so the CTI degree really is a leg up at this point. However, I am in agreement that it should not be offered as a Bachelor's degree, that is a complete waste. At most it should be an Associate's, and really a certificate program would probably suffice. ITT Tech could probably handle it.
 
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jamisjockey

Banned
Jan 10, 2010
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We're not paying for nothing...if we are able to gain employment and make money, that is called a return. If OTS bids were held on a regular basis, CTI would be useless, but as the FAA set up the CTI program, they at some point had to have made a calculated decision to stop the OTS hires and basically hire CTI/VRA (not counting DoD, reinstates, etc...). I would agree that the price for Riddle is high, wahh wahh and so on and so forth, but really, if I get hired in the next 2 years, I will be making over $100k/year by the time I am 30, so in the long run, I would say the investment was worth it. If I had to do it over again, yes, I would go somewhere cheaper if I knew I wouldn't be flying as a career and was going ATC.

For what it's worth, I think the CTI program is a sham, but those of us who graduated weren't told that the CTI schools were pumping 8,000 people into a field that only needed 4,000 people. It's not the CTI schools that f'd up the CTI program (that's called capitalism), it's the FAA's fault for failing to regulate the influx. When the FAA only used to put out OTS bids, tens of thousands of people applied and only a few hundred were selected at a time, a tiny fraction, so the CTI degree really is a leg up at this point. However, I am in agreement that it should not be offered as a Bachelor's degree, that is a complete waste. At most it should be an Associate's, and really a certificate program would probably suffice. ITT Tech could probably handle it.
USMC/USN Air Traffic School is 3 months long. Not sure how long the AF school is.
I'm sure part of the push is so that they can brag about how educated the workforce is. Used to be nothing but a bunch of military vets and off-the street high school grads. Nowadays, you can't pump two squirts of caramel into a soy frap double half calf caramel latte without a degree. While older controllers often don't have any sort of degree, many who enter directly into FAA management come from government academia, with degrees in managing and basket weaving and shit. So to them, all the knuckle draggers on the control floor are a different breed and the idea of an educated workforce seems like some sort of panacea to creating air traffic utopia, I suppose.
Or maybe I need another cup of coffee today. Hold the caramel.