Timeline for CTI

007hamster

Senior Member
Feb 25, 2009
205
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16
NATCA Meeting
I have completed 30 out of 95 credits for the CTI program, and still know very little about the steps necessary for getting to the FAA Academy.

Can anyone list a general timeline of steps from CTI to ATCS? I think I read it on here before, but my search came back with little.
 

aprolla23

Junior Member
Dec 13, 2008
133
0
16
Raleigh, NC
Re: Getting Accepted?

man your better off getting in off the street if you can. Stop wasteing your money.
I wouldn't go as far as to say he's wasting his money. Of course getting in OTS would be a best case scenario, but not guaranteed. I'd say having CTI as a backup is an excellent plan. Plus getting a degree or formal education, in my opinion, is never a waste. I'm biased of course since I'm doing exactly that. Pursuing my CTI degree as well as applying to recent Pubnats is my pathway into ATC.
 

ksheyman

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2009
222
0
16
Indianapolis
I have completed 30 out of 95 credits for the CTI program, and still know very little about the steps necessary for getting to the FAA Academy.

Can anyone list a general timeline of steps from CTI to ATCS? I think I read it on here before, but my search came back with little.
my understanding is such:

-AT-SAT about 6 months before graduation
-apply within weeks of graduating, as soon as you get your letter of recommendation
-wait until the next selection panel, could be weeks or months
-get selected
-attend PEPC whenever the next one happens (weeks or months)
-attend academy whenever they have room (weeks or months)

i believe the process from applying to starting at OKC for CTI ranges from 5 months to 1 year. it all depends on how your timing is. i am about to graduate myself so I'm sure i'll find this all out first hand soon!
 

007hamster

Senior Member
Feb 25, 2009
205
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16
NATCA Meeting
And when do you find out which location you are selected for? After you notify them of your preferences, you are allowed to decline once? No?
 

psloan

Rookie
Jun 2, 2009
25
0
1
Upland, CA
PUBNAT is not always the way to go. For one, there are a lot of people who apply, and of the OTS people accepted, only 20% make it through the acadamy (this is an FAA number). The CTI program will give you far more chances of getting through, not to mention you don't have to do the extra 5 weeks of basic. Furthermore, no matter what, that degree can't be taken away. Once you get the associates from the CTI program, you can easily finish a bachelor's degree... probably before your academy date. The average from graduation to academy is anywhere between 10-18 months.

Another thing worth noting, when you work it ATC, applications for transfers and promotions tend to consider education on a point scale, with associates and bachelors degrees getting more points, so making it easier to advance in your career. Also, CTI students automatically have more seniority than pubnats... so better scheduling, etc.... yes, pubnat is the quick way to go, and if you're close to the age threshold go and do it; Otherwise, take your time, finish the CTI program, apply, continue classes and get a B.S. or B.A..
 

007hamster

Senior Member
Feb 25, 2009
205
0
16
NATCA Meeting
There is a job requirement from CTI to the Academy? I am only 17, 30 credits into the CTI program, and have never had a formal job. I've applied at literally 20 places this summer, and haven't heard squat from anyone. I'm averaging a little above a 3.4 (89%) in the CTI program, so I am by no means a slacker.

What exactly is the requirement, and when is the deadline? Can I be accepted to the Academy before the time is up?
 

ksheyman

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2009
222
0
16
Indianapolis
There is a job requirement from CTI to the Academy? I am only 17, 30 credits into the CTI program, and have never had a formal job. I've applied at literally 20 places this summer, and haven't heard squat from anyone. I'm averaging a little above a 3.4 (89%) in the CTI program, so I am by no means a slacker.

What exactly is the requirement, and when is the deadline? Can I be accepted to the Academy before the time is up?
Great work on the 3.4! Where do you go?

If I can give you one piece of advice when applying for jobs - do NOT apply and then just wait to be called. Most employers do not call applicants, they wait for applicants to call and follow-up on the application. I know that because I used to do applications at my old job. 90% of the time we hired the person who showed us that they wanted the job the most. maybe you are already doing that but since you said you haven't 'heard' from anyone i thought maybe you weren't. with this economy employers are not going to go out of their way to hire you. you have to make it happen for yourself!

As for your question, you can look on the FAA website for the detailed requirements. There are no work experience requirements for CTI applicants. There are requirements for OTS applicants. That's one of the benefits of applying under CTI.

And what do you mean about the 'deadline'?
 

Rosstafari

Daaaang.
Aug 17, 2008
1,149
21
38
39
/X
of the OTS people accepted, only 20% make it through the acadamy (this is an FAA number).
Where from?

Also, CTI students automatically have more seniority than pubnats...
Uh, no they don't. Seniority is based on the day you begin, with preference given to veterans if there's a tie. That's it.

yes, pubnat is the quick way to go, and if you're close to the age threshold go and do it; Otherwise, take your time, finish the CTI program, apply, continue classes and get a B.S. or B.A..
I see what you're trying to say here about PUBNAT being the quick way to go... but when you consider how much longer the application process is for OTS as compared to CTI, that negates some of that. Besides, for some of the reasons you listed and a few more, CTI is the "safer" option, in terms of having a greater probability of getting selected.

Anybody still advocating OTS over CTI as an application path isn't familiar with how much things have changed the past few months. Back during PUBNAT1 and 2, the competition wasn't as fierce and more OTS's were selected. Then the economy tanked, air traffic dropped, and the system became overloaded with trainees (big surprise), so the FAA was able to slow down their hiring, both in terms of numbers and the number of PUBNATs. The new contract will probably push things even further in that direction. At the same time, OTS applications increased, both due to the economy and advertising (so to speak) on the part of the FAA. With fewer spots available and more people gunning for them, OTS has become a much less reliable way to get in.

If someone's serious about ATC as a career, it'd be foolish to put all of your eggs in the PUBNAT basket. Despite the claims made here and elsewhere about the hiring percentage for OTS applicants -- none have been made public by the FAA, so they're all speculation -- most everyone can agree that they're not great. Better to hedge your bets and pick up some education on the way.
 

mills3ff

Junior Member
Mar 3, 2009
86
0
6
Port Orange
PUBNAT is not always the way to go. For one, there are a lot of people who apply, and of the OTS people accepted, only 20% make it through the acadamy (this is an FAA number). The CTI program will give you far more chances of getting through, not to mention you don't have to do the extra 5 weeks of basic. Furthermore, no matter what, that degree can't be taken away. Once you get the associates from the CTI program, you can easily finish a bachelor's degree... probably before your academy date. The average from graduation to academy is anywhere between 10-18 months.

Another thing worth noting, when you work it ATC, applications for transfers and promotions tend to consider education on a point scale, with associates and bachelors degrees getting more points, so making it easier to advance in your career. Also, CTI students automatically have more seniority than pubnats... so better scheduling, etc.... yes, pubnat is the quick way to go, and if you're close to the age threshold go and do it; Otherwise, take your time, finish the CTI program, apply, continue classes and get a B.S. or B.A..
What percent CTI make it through the Academy?
 

ksheyman

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2009
222
0
16
Indianapolis
Where from?



Uh, no they don't. Seniority is based on the day you begin, with preference given to veterans if there's a tie. That's it.



I see what you're trying to say here about PUBNAT being the quick way to go... but when you consider how much longer the application process is for OTS as compared to CTI, that negates some of that. Besides, for some of the reasons you listed and a few more, CTI is the "safer" option, in terms of having a greater probability of getting selected.

Anybody still advocating OTS over CTI as an application path isn't familiar with how much things have changed the past few months. Back during PUBNAT1 and 2, the competition wasn't as fierce and more OTS's were selected. Then the economy tanked, air traffic dropped, and the system became overloaded with trainees (big surprise), so the FAA was able to slow down their hiring, both in terms of numbers and the number of PUBNATs. The new contract will probably push things even further in that direction. At the same time, OTS applications increased, both due to the economy and advertising (so to speak) on the part of the FAA. With fewer spots available and more people gunning for them, OTS has become a much less reliable way to get in.

If someone's serious about ATC as a career, it'd be foolish to put all of your eggs in the PUBNAT basket. Despite the claims made here and elsewhere about the hiring percentage for OTS applicants -- none have been made public by the FAA, so they're all speculation -- most everyone can agree that they're not great. Better to hedge your bets and pick up some education on the way.
I like your style, rossta. I'll buy you a drink when you get to seattle (i live there).
 

ksheyman

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2009
222
0
16
Indianapolis
I go to Green River, I love it there!

So, can anyone confirm that the 6 months prior employment does not apply to those hired CTI?
Ok I'm gonna take a long-shot wild guess here and say your first name is........... Jonathan (aka Channo (sp?)). Am I right?


And dude, this link is for the CTI announcement. Read through the qualifications.

USAJOBS - Search Jobs

It does not mention work experience. Now take a look at the off-the-street announcement (i had to copy it in since there isn't a current posting):

Minimum Qualifications : ***Age Requirements***: A maximum age of 30 years is established for entry into air traffic control positions covered by Public Law 92-297. Persons who have reached their 31st birthdays may not be originally appointed to these positions. If experience was gained as a civilian ATCS with the Department of Defense (DOD), you must have been hired prior to age 31. Maximum Retention Age: 5 USC 8335 (a) and 5 USC 8425 (a) require mandatory separation at age 56 in a career controller position. Please contact Aviation Careers Division at (405) 954-4657 for any questions regarding this requirement. Prior experience or training in air traffic control is not required. Applicants will be evaluated based on their responses to the online application. You may qualify for this position on the basis of work experience, college education, or a combination of both. TO QUALIFY BASED ON WORK EXPERIENCE, INTERESTED INDIVIDUALS MUST DOCUMENT THREE YEARS OF PROGRESSIVELY RESPONSIBLE FULL-TIME (40 HOURS PER WEEK) EXPERIENCE THAT DEMONSTRATES THE POTENTIAL FOR LEARNING. Progressively responsible experience might include for example: an increase in leadership duties, working with less supervision, or an increase in financial responsibility. You are encouraged to include any experience that is directly related to the air traffic control occupation. TO QUALIFY BASED UPON EDUCATION, APPLICANTS MUST DOCUMENT A FULL 4-YEAR COURSE OF STUDY LEADING TO A BACHELOR'S DEGREE AND INCLUDE SEMESTER/QUARTER COLLEGE HOURS. SCHOOLS MUST BE ACCREDITED BY AN ACCREDITING INSTITUTION RECOGNIZED BY THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION. You may also qualify by combining your work experience & college credits; one year of undergraduate study (30 semester hours or 45 quarter hours) is equivalent to 9 months of general work experience. Successful candidates must be able to speak English clearly enough to be understood over radios, intercoms, & similar communications equipment. ***Medical Requirements: Selectee must pass a medical examination prior to appointment. Male applicants born after December 31, 1959, must certify at the time of appointment that they have registered with the Selective Service System, or are exempt from having to do so under the Selective Service Law. Applications will first be reviewed to determine if they meet the minimum qualification requirements. Failure to meet minimum qualification requirements automatically disqualifies an applicant. ...... Additional information on this job is located at: Air Traffic Controllers ........The ATCS hiring process involves many steps with many offices, after the announcement close date, you can log into ASAP to check your status to take the AT-SAT exam, for your exam score, and referral list updates. All updates are available through the on-line application system. Applicants must apply on-line to receive consideration for this vacancy announcement. Faxed, Mailed or e-mailed applications cannot be accepted.

Other Job Requirements : Requirement for pre-employment medical clearance: Applicants selected for ATCS positions must pass a medical examination that includes psychological screening prior to appointment. Applicants with prior military service are encouraged to obtain a sealed copy of their military medical records prior to discharge and to retain these records to be provided upon request if selected.

Requirement for security clearance: This position requires an Access National Agency Check and Inquiry with Credit (ANACI) or higher, based on the facility, prior to appointment unless a waiver is obtained.

Department of Transportation's Drug and Alcohol Testing Program: This position is covered by the Department of Transportation's Drug and Alcohol Testing Program. Any applicant tentatively selected for this position will be subject to a pre-employment or pre-appointment drug screening. Persons occupying covered positions will be subject to random drug and/or alcohol testing.

Training Requirements: Developmentals will enter the appropriate phase of field training as determined by the assigned facility to prepare for advancement to the Certified Professional Controller (CPC) level. They must learn the skills needed for operation at higher levels of responsibility. Failure to meet training requirements for or accept promotion to higher grade ATCS positions may constitute grounds for reassignment, demotion or separation from employment.

Certificate and Rating Requirements: ATCS's must possess or obtain a valid ATCS Certificate and/or Control Tower Operator Certificate (CTO) if appropriate. They must also obtain the facility ratings required for full performance at assigned facilities within uniformly applicable time limits.

Interview: Candidates for ATCS positions may be subject to pre-appointment interviews to determine whether they possess the personal characteristics necessary to perform air traffic control work.

Requirement for nonstandard duty hours or work week: Incumbent may be required to work irregular duty hours or a nonstandard work week or tour of duty.
 

007hamster

Senior Member
Feb 25, 2009
205
0
16
NATCA Meeting
Nope. But thanks.

"Applicants should include examples of specialized experience in their Work History. Multiple selections may be made from this announcement." :confused:
 

ksheyman

Senior Member
Feb 3, 2009
222
0
16
Indianapolis
Nope. But thanks.

"Applicants should include examples of specialized experience in their Work History. Multiple selections may be made from this announcement." :confused:
A suggestion, not a requirement. They are just saying that if you have experience, let them know. If you look at the language of the OTS announcement it explicitly says that you must have X number of years experience to qualify. On the CTI posting, the sentence you quoted is the only mention. If you aren't going to believe me then be my guest and get a job. I'm sure it wouldn't hurt anyway.

And sorry, I also go to green river. You sounded like a friend of mine.
 

rogersjf

Trusted Contributor
Mar 11, 2009
656
9
18
New Jersey
PUBNAT is not always the way to go. For one, there are a lot of people who apply, and of the OTS people accepted, only 20% make it through the acadamy (this is an FAA number).
Rosstafari always says it the best, that number is false. You may be mistaken, where as the 20% is what they take from the total PUBNATS for hiring. Where as quoting the director of training who was at school. "We do not look at Pubnats who score under 90% on the AtSat" the reason being there is just not that many spots available per panel, so when you combine multiple pubnats for a panel your chances of getting selected drop. As for CTI the current number they hire who successfully graduate and get recommended is 90%. Plus CTI can still spply for Pubnats so tech your chance of getting selected are twice as much as anyone else.

FY 2008 they selected 2,196 people, of that 823 were CTI grads, 720 had prior experience (CPCIT, VRA etc) The rest 653 were OTS.

The % work out to around;
CTI - 38%
Prior Exper. - 33%
OTS - 29%

This number is sure to drop for OTS due to the fact, many 4 year CTI grads will be coming out for grad and the FAA states themselves that they expect CTI schools to have the overall numbers for hires they need.

"In the past five years, AT-CTI schools have graduated more than 4,000 students from their aviation programs - 3,000 of whom were hired by the FAA. By FY 2010, the agency anticipates up to 35 AT-CTI schools in the program graduating 2,000 to 2,500 students per year." (Pg 35 workforceplan)

What percent CTI make it through the Academy?
If you apply yourself you should have no problem at OKC. I believe the current rate for all people at OKC is above 95%, it is really when you get to your facility to checkout where alot of people wash out.

Can anyone list a general timeline of steps from CTI to ATCS? I think I read it on here before, but my search came back with little.
As for the original question, it is really though to say because your timeline really depends on how the FAA is doing on paperwork, if they are behind then you got a longer wait if they are ahead you could get done with it quicker (but then you gotta wait for an OKC date) Here are the steps(from the faa)


1.Be recommended for hiring by a CTI school (Grad. AS or BA doesnt matter you get paid the same)
2.Achieve a qualifying score on the current FAA testing procedures.(ATSAT)(Completed prior to grad.)
- Get selected at a panel (Every Quarter there are panels sometimes more)
3.Meet entry-level Air Traffic Control Specialist (ATCS) medical standards. (PEPC or Trad. Timing depends on FAA and your Sech.)
4.Pass pre-employment drug test. (PEPC or Trad. Timing depends on FAA and your Sech.)
5.Pass the background investigation for security and suitability. (Up to the FBI on how long they take)
6.Have United States citizenship. (X)
7.May not have reached their 31st birthday prior to initial appointment. (X)
8.Complete course work including all CTI-specific required courses. (Grad.)
9.Be able to read, write, and understand the English language and speak it rapidly without accent or impediment of speech. (X)
10.Successfully complete the FAA interview process. (PEPC or Trad. Timing depends on FAA and your Sech.)

11. GET A OKC DATE (9-18 months)

Overall it does not matter if you go PEPC or Trad due to the fact all the paper work goes to the same place and it all still has to get processed. So you can get done what you need to get done in a timely manor. however waiting for the FAA to check and confirm all your paper work can take some time. After your folder is complete you now gotta wait for a OKC date which is a long wait currently (9-18 months). Hope it helps.
 

tulsahockey19

Newcomer
Aug 25, 2009
15
0
1
So would it be better to go to a CTI school then get picked up off the street? is that what (OTS) stands for?