Tower training "must knows'?

Visual24

Newcomer
Jul 27, 2010
6
0
1
Rochester, MN
What is some "must know ahead of time" information for CTI graduates going to OKC? MY CTI program was completely based around ARTCC and I've been placed in a tower. I have an ATB study guide and of course have the 7110 and the FAR's but if there is anything specific I should be glancing over let me know. Thanks.
 

jalvis81

Senior Member
May 4, 2009
201
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16
chapter 3... ALL
They will teach you everything you need to know. The most important thing IMO to really nail down was aircraft types. They give you a sheet like the 2nd day of class. Learn their weight class and category, for wake turbulence and same runway separation, respectively.
 

SFO_RCTO

Junior Member
Aug 24, 2010
81
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6
Bay Area, California
They will teach you everything you need to know. The most important thing IMO to really nail down was aircraft types. They give you a sheet like the 2nd day of class. Learn their weight class and category, for wake turbulence and same runway separation, respectively.
Regarding a/c types, I am great at commercial aviation. I'm familiar with all the heavies, 737 series, a320 series (18,19,20, 21) etc, but my flaw is with general aviation and corporate jets. So what I do, I go on airliners.net and select an airport such as Van Nuys with plenty of GA. I then cover half the screen with the data, and as I see each photo I try to see if I can name the aircraft type. It seems to help, since in the last month I have learned Beech 99, Beech Bonanza, Global Express, Citation Jets, Hawkers, Gulfstreams, Falcons, Galaxy jets, Lear jets, Metro liners, Legacy jets, and a few others. Now this only pertains to aircraft identification, as I have yet to learn the aircraft weights and characteristics for each of the above. Suggestions?
 

The Heatles

Loving Life
Jun 15, 2008
2,172
24
38
Miami, FL
Definitely aircraft identification like said. On airliners.net they even have an aircraft recognition game that kinda interesting. A few aircraft that are borderline rare that you will never see, but good for the most part.

Or just buy a "Jane's" aircraft recognition book... you can find them on Ebay for like $10


Link to the recognition game:
Airliners.net Aircraft Recognition Quiz
 

SFO_RCTO

Junior Member
Aug 24, 2010
81
0
6
Bay Area, California
Definitely aircraft identification like said. On airliners.net they even have an aircraft recognition game that kinda interesting. A few aircraft that are borderline rare that you will never see, but good for the most part.

Or just buy a "Jane's" aircraft recognition book... you can find them on Ebay for like $10


Link to the recognition game:
Airliners.net Aircraft Recognition Quiz
Right on man! Took my first quiz, got 18 outta 20! Not bad man. Thanks for the link. Ima be on this constantly!
 

Visual24

Newcomer
Jul 27, 2010
6
0
1
Rochester, MN
Thanks for the posts all. I used airliners.net quite a bit when I graduated CTI in August 08. But, when you've waited for two years it's tough to stay motivated. Just got the call so now it's back though :D. Thanks again and good luck all.
 

Fuentes980

Newcomer
Nov 8, 2009
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I would agree with most other people...A/C types are huge... Cat 1 2 3... and their FAA designator. I bought a janes book, cross referenced against the 7110.65 appendix and just made a list of names and designators.. The pictures don't even matter as much, to me most singe engine cessnas look alike anyway.

All of the separation they're gonna teach you, and your gonna get your ass kicked once you start problems. Just have fun with it. and go to club Rodeo!
 

SFO_RCTO

Junior Member
Aug 24, 2010
81
0
6
Bay Area, California
Got a question regarding "most singe engine cessnas look alike anyway." If one is in control, working ground, and for example you have three 747's, two 737's, a 777, and a G5. If you tell one of the aircraft, lets say a 737, to give way to the G5, can you just say "Give way to the Gulfstream" or do you have to say "Give way to the Gulfstream G5"? Thats the first question. Second, you now wanna tell the G5 that the 737 will "Give way to you", do you say, "The Boeing 737 series 800 will be giving way to you"? Point I'm trying to make is do we have to know every series and subtype, or can I just realize that a Boeing 737 is a 737 regardless of it's 9 series? Or in your case, the Cessna...
 

The Heatles

Loving Life
Jun 15, 2008
2,172
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38
Miami, FL
You wont say any of that at the academy so dont think too much into it.


In the real ATC world it all comes down to technique. Neither is really right or wrong. Everyone chooses to say it differently.

"Follow the Delta Regional Jet, Follow the RJ, follow Delta to your left", etc... Its dependant on the situation at hand. If you have 2,3, or 4 Deltas you dont want to say "follow Delta" obviously. Just something that will be clearly understood by the pilot.
 

Fuentes980

Newcomer
Nov 8, 2009
3
0
1
I agree with Polo. You'll probably never see that at academy, and reading too much into it is frankly a waste of time. Winglets or no winglets... No one really cares (especially pilots). If your working a civil and you don't know what type he is.... ASK!

I tell my trainees to put themselves in the pilots seat and give easy to understand instructions.

If you want to see what working a tower is like, and since your in the Bay area i would suggest calling OAK to see if you can get a fam trip. Oakland has two towers one for GA and the other is commercial. The view is sick, the controllers are cool and it'll be fun and a learning experience.
 

Steve_O

Rookie
Feb 4, 2010
45
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6
40
Jacksonville, FL
They will teach you everything, but the biggest thing you need to know is wake turbulence and runway separation. It's what most people need to study on. Aircraft rec isn't really major once you get in to running the scenarios because by that time you will already know what a Cessna, Baron, Cheyanne and stuff like that are. Know which ones move faster than others and you will be just fine. Oh, and remember... if a B757 or a heavy jet depart and rotate prior to Runway 16 (which they all will) there is a 2 minute wake turbulence timer on the R16 departure and it's not waiverable. (That will fail you on your PV, even if everything else you did was perfect) Good luck
 

Steve_O

Rookie
Feb 4, 2010
45
0
6
40
Jacksonville, FL
By the way, Club Rodeo is horrible... whoever told you to go there was trying to trick you. A bunch of people got their cars broken in to there, also at the BWW right off of I-40
 

eqfan592

Rookie
Mar 28, 2010
54
0
6
Good tips, Steve. Also, another thing to remember when dealing with heavy's/757's is that you can't line up an aircraft in the small weight class behind a departed heavy/757 until you have wake turbulence separation. That one managed to catch me today while running a bit of an air show of a problem (that you were watching, Steve, lol).

And I agree about Club Rodeo. It's an over-priced POS. Unique, yes, but not really in many good ways.
 

Roddy_Piper

Resident Knucklehead
Jun 15, 2008
3,339
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Vegas baby
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Got a question regarding "most singe engine cessnas look alike anyway." If one is in control, working ground, and for example you have three 747's, two 737's, a 777, and a G5. If you tell one of the aircraft, lets say a 737, to give way to the G5, can you just say "Give way to the Gulfstream" or do you have to say "Give way to the Gulfstream G5"? Thats the first question. Second, you now wanna tell the G5 that the 737 will "Give way to you", do you say, "The Boeing 737 series 800 will be giving way to you"? Point I'm trying to make is do we have to know every series and subtype, or can I just realize that a Boeing 737 is a 737 regardless of it's 9 series? Or in your case, the Cessna...
i don't differentiate between the series numbers. a 733, 735, 737, 739 is all the same on the ground. i just call them "seven threes". "follow the southwest seven three". in the air the series number means a little more with performance in mind.

in the GA world i treat them the same also. a G3, G4, G5 are all the same as far as traffic, but means a little the more you watch the different types perform. "follow the gulfstream". it may get a little tricky if wake turbulence is involved, for instance the F900 or CL60 being the preceeding aircraft on the approach. then i'll say the actual model number instead of just "falcon jet".
 

duranme

Senior Analyst
Nov 3, 2009
920
13
18
BUR
what the f*ck is this "give way to" shit... damn tower flowers almost as bad as center pukes...
 

atcguruaf

Rico Suave
Jan 4, 2009
1,377
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36
Right here
Got a question regarding "most singe engine cessnas look alike anyway." If one is in control, working ground, and for example you have three 747's, two 737's, a 777, and a G5. If you tell one of the aircraft, lets say a 737, to give way to the G5, can you just say "Give way to the Gulfstream" or do you have to say "Give way to the Gulfstream G5"? Thats the first question. Second, you now wanna tell the G5 that the 737 will "Give way to you", do you say, "The Boeing 737 series 800 will be giving way to you"? Point I'm trying to make is do we have to know every series and subtype, or can I just realize that a Boeing 737 is a 737 regardless of it's 9 series? Or in your case, the Cessna...
1. "Give way" is not part of the phraseology required to be used.
Ref. - Taxi and Ground Movement Operations

2. You would say the following: "...behind the Gulfstream" or "follow the Gulfstream" or "Follow the G5", or "Follow the Gulfstream G5"
Ref. - 2-4-21, Description of Aircraft Types

Ref. -3-7-2, Taxi and Ground Movement Operations
Note - 2-4-21 only provides examples of what they want you to use. According to the definition of "EXAMPLE", if there is no associated phraseology, you may use other words that get the same message across. The things above I stated are also examples. However, the .65 is clear as to what must be included when describing aircraft. It even separates the requirement by category (Military, Air Carrier, etc.).

3. For your next question, you apply the same rule as answered in #2 above.

4. You do not have to know every series and sub-type. You can just realize that a Boeying 737 is a 737 regardless if it's a 9 series. However, if there are 2 or 3, you may want to specify "...the 2nd B737" etc.